Sept. 18, 2024

NEWS: Dark Nights and the "Home of Halloween"

NEWS: Dark Nights and the "Home of Halloween"

Read the full stories https://mailchi.mp/hauntedattractionnetwork.com/dark-nights-opens-at-hersheypark. Dark Nights at Hersheypark opened this past weekend - featuring 5 haunts and 3 scare zones; Howl-O-Scream at Busch Gardens Williamsburg has seen...

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Read the full stories here. Dark Nights at Hersheypark opened this past weekend - featuring 5 haunts and 3 scare zones; Howl-O-Scream at Busch Gardens Williamsburg has seen two incidents over the past two weekends: a large altercation in its opening weekend and a stabbing this past Saturday; The Haunted Attraction Association names their 50 "Top Haunts" of 2024; Embrace your inner cat-lady with this year's New York City Village Halloween Parade theme - "Meow!"; Portals of Fear Haunted Attraction will not operate during the 2024 Halloween season due to an "unforeseen real estate logistical issue"; Halloween Nights at Eastern State Penitentiary returns with a new immersive-theater-style experience; Toms River Halloween Parade celebrates its 85th annual event this Halloween; The Haunt in Atascadero celebrates its 10th anniversary with "Dr. Frankenstein's Monsters"; Haunted Little Tokyo returns to Los Angeles for its 7th annual block party on October 26th; Explore the history of the "birthplace of Halloween" with Tourism Ireland's new tourism campaign, "Home of Halloween"; Maan Farms' The Scariest Corn Maze in Canada returns select dates September 27th - November 3rd; The official trailer has been released for "Haunt Season", a horror movie filmed at Realm of Terror haunted attraction; Home haunter Marianna Peters was contacted by her local city council after neighbors complained that August was too early for Halloween decorations; A yard display by home haunter Bill Pyles gives comfort to a cancer survivor; The Glen Falls Collaborative announces their annual Halloween House Competition for local residents and businesses.

WEBVTT

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Okay, no, the coffee is kicking off. Welcome to our bonus.

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Green tagged unhinged.

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You gotta we got to go in and change that somehow.

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We have to change itage it.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, we got to change it from green tag pro

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to green tag unhinged because that just makes so much

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more sense as to what we're doing here.

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So, Scott, staffing is like a cluster.

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This it's a mess. It is a mess, and we've

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been trying to figure out so and this is this

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is staffing. You know, I'm always looking primarily at staffing

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for for we'll call it labor of a certain skill set.

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But even then it's not you know, I'm not looking

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for people who have twenty five years of performance experience.

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You know, I need someone, I need someone, I need

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scare actors, I need elves, I need you know that

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kind of thing. And pretty much in all the markets

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that that I'm working at, in all the markets, we're

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we're struggling not only to find the people but also

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to get them to keep to stay as part of

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the cast. And you know we talked about in the show.

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You know, Disney is reducing its it's it's cap on

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the Aspire program. But you know what, and we're we're

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all trying to figure out what kind of benefits are

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going to bring people in, because you know, the smaller

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or mid level attractions, they can't afford to be the top,

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top paying gig in town. And quite honestly, from what

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I'm hearing, even the elements that are the top paying

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gigs in town are having trouble finding people and having

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trouble maintaining people. And and I, you know, I part

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of it is my fault. I know, because in the

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creative development, I was like, oh, we were doing well

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last year on casting, let's let's continue to grow on

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this trend. Well, we can clearly expand the number of

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people that will need for next year, which would be

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this year. And that's not the case. But I also

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think that the operational side, my operational cohorts in all

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of these are on, hey, we can be a little

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pickier because these folks weren't you know, they weren't the best,

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so maybe we cannot hire them this year. But that's

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not necessarily the case. And but I mean it's the

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point now where you know, normally when you're looking for performers,

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there's there's plenty of websites, and there's plenty of Facebook

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groups and social media pages and all that. But but

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we're even posting on indeed, I mean, just reaching out

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to pretty much anyone and everyone. I will say it

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is kind of humorous some of the people we get on. Indeed,

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we had we had one and and I'm not telling

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tales out of school, but we did have one, uh

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one person apply for a performance position in Indianapolis from Malaysia.

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Wow.

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Okay, so now you can understand the kind of shenanigans

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that we're getting from that. We're having people it's very

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difficult for people to show up to get them to

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show up to audition, it's very difficult to get them

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to once given a position, to keep it. There's been

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all and there's been all kinds of reasoning behind not

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keeping positions this year, which my favorite just happened to

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be the universe tells me I shouldn't right now, Oh

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my god.

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Okay, So.

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I don't know is it true? Is that true everywhere Philip?

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Or is it just performance or what's what seems to

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be the I don't know, what's your thought? What do

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you think about this staffing, the ongoing or the recurring

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or the reoccurring maybe that's more accurate, the reoccurring staffing challenge.

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I just have noticed it as a guest, actually, and

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I don't think it's just me.

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I think I think so.

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I know I was told or I found out off

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the record, of course, for Field of Screams that you know,

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because I was there night two, So night one they

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had I think one hundred and fifty actors and night

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two they had eighty. You know, so already between night

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one and two, like the drop was substantial as to

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who showed up the second night, and for the same

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similar reasons. Right, people were tired or they didn't know

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what it was going to be and blah blah.

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Blah blah, all that stuff.

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I didn't officially hear anything about hershey, but I could

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feel that there were less actors. And I even know

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having made the videos of the same houses because they

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were all repeated except for the new house, right, But.

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There were.

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More actors last year, just in looking at the two videos,

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because there were you could tell last year all the

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all the scare spots were filled and this year you

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a lot of spots missing. And I did you did

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even see that in the like when I posted it

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on YouTube, that was even comments people are making, like

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like they literally they were like, well, there are only

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five actors in this whole haunt. And I'm like, well,

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I mean yeah, I mean it's kind of true or

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less like five or less really is what I would say,

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right like in this haunt. And so I think I

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remember we I talked about it with Universal as well,

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you know, like even them not being able to manage breaks.

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I mean, like I don't well, and then my question

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is what's gonna happen by the end of the season,

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you know, because if if they've if they've got a

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you know what, what if they're looking at a sixty

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seventy person drop yep in you know it's it's like

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a forty percent drop in the first night. What's gonna

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happen by the end of the run? And what's interesting is,

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you know, as a designer, I look at it and

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I go, Okay, well, then I'll start designing things that

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require fewer and fewer live performers. And then the ticket

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price goes up on the other end because they have

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to buy more more interactive scenic or more interactive you know,

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more triggers, more animations, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

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So it's really we're really getting we're really stuck between

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a rock and a hard place. And I would love,

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as the quote unquote or as a quote unquote expert,

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I would love to have a great solution to all this,

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but I can't figure it out. I just I don't know.

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People don't seem to want to work. That's the that's

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the number one issue for me. And it's you know,

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it's it's all these crazy kids. You think they can

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make a living as a content creator, and many of

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them are and earning significantly more than they could ever

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make as a hunted attraction performer or a Christmas attraction

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performer or even a theme park performer. And I get that,

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but I just I don't know. I don't know how

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to handle it. And we've even in some of the

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some of my clients, we've even actually gone down because

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it used to be eighteen and up with all of

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my clients, and we've even gone down to sixteen or

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fifteen if they're there with a parent. With some of

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our that is so.

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God. I agree, Like I have no idea.

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I mean, I you know, not being a person that's

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you know, but just from hearing I don't I haven't

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heard a solution from anybody. And what I don't like

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is I hear a lot of denial, and I hear

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a lot of like, uh, you know, a lot of like,

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well they'll just have to learn or kind of whatever.

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And I'm like, well, like.

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You know, I mean, like you're not their parent, right,

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Like it's not gonna like that's not gonna fix it.

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We're gonna have to keep like Disney, I guess, like

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Disney's doing, I guess, and we're gonna have to keep

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figuring out what is going to actually retain them because

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brute force temption is not going to work clearly. And

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but to your point about the kids, like again I

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didn't want to say this, but like, oh my god,

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like there were a lot that well, I don't want

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to say it, like a lot, but there were like

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child actors at Field of Screams. I mean like like

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I mean like there was a school bus. Fine, you know,

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like I get okay, I'm glad you put them in

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the school bus, but like I mean they were like

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they had to be like middle school or younger. Like it.

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I was like oh my god.

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Yeah, it's well. And obviously this is more true of

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the independent Hunters than it is of the theme park

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hunders because theme parks can't do it from an insurance standpoint.

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But but it's almost become haunted attraction has almost become

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like the the New Circus when it comes to staffing.

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I mean, one of the things that that circus was

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known for back in the Bush Gardens days is they

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would they would they'd pro create so that they could

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have new cast members. I mean, because again, when you've

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got a risly act or a hand balancing act or whatever,

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people age out of that pretty quickly. And it's not

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something that you can just go out and say, yeah,

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I'm going to find this guy on the street or

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this this gal who was a great waitress and had

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a great smile, and I'll train them how to do this.

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This is stuff they have to start when they're infants.

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And so it was it was very common in the

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circus to have these acts that would have miners because

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they were just learning the trade and moving up in it.

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But now we're in the independent Haunts. It's and it's

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weird because it's almost to guarantee because if you hire

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mom and the three kids and dad. Well, if mom

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and dad want to do it, if they're you know,

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died in the wool haunt folk and they want to

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do it, they're going to drag the kids along. So

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you know they're going to be there. You know, the

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attendance is going to be there, and they can't leave

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the kids behind because they'll have to, you know, bring

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in babysitters for them, or and then mom and dad

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can't come. So you know, maybe that maybe that is

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one of the solutions. It's to start looking for real families.

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I don't know, I I think.

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So this is my hypothesis.

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And again, you know, obviously I'm not an operator anymore,

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but I would say my hypothesis is not necessarily that

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family dynamic that you mentioned. It's more like the people

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want to have fun. And basically I think two things.

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What got us here as in the mindset previously like

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it's a job and whatever the old haunters have and

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the old intertained professionals have, that is not going to

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get us in the future. For whatever reason. There's a

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million reasons pandemic education, social media culture about but whatever,

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I think one solution might be it's not necessarily that

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they need to be a family, but it's more like

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that they have a reason to want to come in.

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So if it's a family, you know, like the you know,

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the parents, you know, like the kids and whatever or

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they have. But also it's like the relationships, like it's

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fun to be at the work location because to me,

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and again this is all anecdotal, right, but what I

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noticed is where it seems like they have the actors

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is in the acting jobs that are quote unquote fun,

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so like the scare zones because they just wander around

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and can do whatever they want, and they can interact

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with the other actors.

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They could have a little whatever it filled the screams.

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Like there are the places that were best staffed, where

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like the rooms that were like near each other, where

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they had one or two actors per scene that could

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that got along with each other and they could like

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play off of each other. And the places that were

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the sparsest were the ones that were like outside where

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there's only one actor maybe in like a hut and

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they're just by themselves, or you know, where it's like

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their ice and it's a long run because all the

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meandering in the woods and where they just pop out,

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and the same thing. I notice at Universal right, the

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ones that were the least were the ones where you

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00:12:10.919 --> 00:12:13.120
just pop out. And if you think about it, if

224
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you break that down, you're like, well, because the reality

225
00:12:16.000 --> 00:12:18.799
is that job sucks because you just pop out of

226
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a corner, you know, every five thirty seconds or whatever,

227
00:12:22.279 --> 00:12:24.279
and you have no one to talk to, you have

228
00:12:24.360 --> 00:12:26.720
no support around you or anything. You just pop out

229
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of a corner. I'm not sure that's going to be

230
00:12:29.799 --> 00:12:34.159
a viable option in the future or this year are

231
00:12:34.159 --> 00:12:36.360
going on. I think that we're really going to have

232
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to think about, like the performers are going to want

233
00:12:39.000 --> 00:12:45.039
to you know, engage with the customers and want to

234
00:12:45.399 --> 00:12:47.120
have a support SYSM around them and want to hang

235
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out with people and want to just have fun, which.

236
00:12:51.240 --> 00:12:51.879
I don't know, I mean.

237
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But the flip side, it's that there are some people,

238
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quite a few people who come to the auditions who

239
00:12:57.200 --> 00:12:59.919
want a job and their skill set is such that

240
00:13:00.080 --> 00:13:02.039
all they are capable of doing is popping out and

241
00:13:02.039 --> 00:13:06.320
saying boom. I mean, the you know, and what ends

242
00:13:06.399 --> 00:13:07.519
up happening is.

243
00:13:07.440 --> 00:13:08.840
They don't want to do it and they're not going

244
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to stay there, so it's it's I think it's a

245
00:13:10.639 --> 00:13:12.559
pointless endeavor, but.

246
00:13:12.519 --> 00:13:14.159
We got, but we got There's got to be something

247
00:13:14.440 --> 00:13:16.200
I don't know. We've even tried in the past. We've

248
00:13:16.240 --> 00:13:20.559
even tried getting like service organizations, like university service organizations

249
00:13:20.639 --> 00:13:27.240
like fraternity sororities who would donate their donate their time.

250
00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:30.279
And I say donate their time because we would pay

251
00:13:30.639 --> 00:13:33.320
for each person that they would provide, but they would

252
00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:35.679
then take that We would pay the fraternity or the sorority.

253
00:13:35.879 --> 00:13:38.279
Then they would take that money and use it to

254
00:13:38.759 --> 00:13:41.320
support their favorite charity, their favorite cause.

255
00:13:41.360 --> 00:13:44.799
When I have it, I I've done that even before

256
00:13:45.679 --> 00:13:50.919
with my haunts, and I think that is a potential

257
00:13:51.759 --> 00:13:54.039
also thing. But I think it still relates back to

258
00:13:54.039 --> 00:13:55.960
what I mean, like it basically it gives them a purpose.

259
00:13:56.399 --> 00:13:58.919
Yeah, I think you're right. I think as we move forward,

260
00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:01.320
we've got to start looking more purpose based, not just

261
00:14:01.399 --> 00:14:04.879
payment based. Yes, but in order to do that, we

262
00:14:04.960 --> 00:14:07.480
have to find people who have the skills to do

263
00:14:07.519 --> 00:14:11.000
the job. And I'm also you know, here's the other

264
00:14:11.039 --> 00:14:12.799
thing that is.

265
00:14:14.039 --> 00:14:16.200
You like, sliders always show up. That's all I'm saying.

266
00:14:16.559 --> 00:14:18.720
Sliders always show up because usually they're on the highest

267
00:14:18.759 --> 00:14:21.279
pay scale. Number one and number two, it is a

268
00:14:21.279 --> 00:14:24.720
skill set that they don't get another option to do

269
00:14:24.759 --> 00:14:27.720
anywhere else. And you don't learn to slide as a

270
00:14:27.720 --> 00:14:30.039
former slider. And I say former because my old body

271
00:14:30.039 --> 00:14:32.720
couldn't do it anymore. But as a former slider, I

272
00:14:32.759 --> 00:14:34.799
would go and slide at least once a year just

273
00:14:34.840 --> 00:14:38.120
to say I could still do it, even when my

274
00:14:38.279 --> 00:14:41.840
job did not suggest it. So it was, Yes, it

275
00:14:41.919 --> 00:14:45.320
was fun, Yes it was something. But you can't have

276
00:14:45.519 --> 00:14:48.559
an entire you can't have an entire park of sliders.

277
00:14:48.879 --> 00:14:50.960
Number one, you couldn't find enough people to do it.

278
00:14:51.320 --> 00:14:54.440
Number two, it would get boring really really fast.

279
00:14:55.279 --> 00:14:59.120
And let me tell you Hershey Park and six Flags are.

280
00:14:59.039 --> 00:15:03.480
Trying well, but sliders sliders have become the new chainsaws.

281
00:15:03.559 --> 00:15:05.720
I mean it's it's like, we know they work, so

282
00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:08.639
let's put them everywhere. It was sort of like the

283
00:15:08.759 --> 00:15:10.759
it was sort of like the bungee, the slingshot. You know,

284
00:15:10.840 --> 00:15:12.600
it was like when that came, when that hit the market,

285
00:15:12.639 --> 00:15:14.639
it was like, oh, that always works. Let's add that

286
00:15:14.679 --> 00:15:19.759
to every single haunt we could possibly find. And you know,

287
00:15:19.879 --> 00:15:23.000
and I'm guilty of that, I did it too, because

288
00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:25.519
it was it was cheap and easy in the grand

289
00:15:25.519 --> 00:15:28.720
scheme of things to create something that was incredibly impactful,

290
00:15:29.320 --> 00:15:32.000
and the downside of that is it was exhausting.

291
00:15:32.080 --> 00:15:35.200
But yeah, like I guess I'm just saying I talked

292
00:15:35.240 --> 00:15:38.960
to a few so I at at Hershey Park, like

293
00:15:39.039 --> 00:15:41.159
I agree with everything. We don't have a solution, but

294
00:15:41.200 --> 00:15:43.720
I'm just I'm just mentioning anecdotal things. But like when

295
00:15:43.720 --> 00:15:45.440
I was at Hershey Park, I got given a host

296
00:15:45.440 --> 00:15:49.759
family to make refudia with, which is always fun and

297
00:15:49.840 --> 00:15:53.279
you know, so, but it was two kids that were

298
00:15:53.320 --> 00:15:56.799
like around that age, and I think like we were

299
00:15:56.840 --> 00:15:59.039
in it taking a break in the mom and I

300
00:15:59.120 --> 00:16:01.440
were talking with them, you know, their mom was there,

301
00:16:01.559 --> 00:16:04.320
and you know, I think one of the one of

302
00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:08.559
the boy, the boy was like I can't It's like

303
00:16:08.600 --> 00:16:10.919
I basically he was like I can't imagine being a

304
00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:14.519
character and and and I was like, well, what about

305
00:16:14.679 --> 00:16:17.120
because he's been to Field of Screams. He's say Field Screams,

306
00:16:17.159 --> 00:16:19.519
like it's so intense, and he's like in Hershey is

307
00:16:19.559 --> 00:16:23.360
you know, And I was like, well, what could you imagine?

308
00:16:23.399 --> 00:16:25.600
He's like, well, I think it would be fun if

309
00:16:25.600 --> 00:16:27.919
I were hanging out and I could do you know,

310
00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:30.159
this type in this environment and these would be funny.

311
00:16:30.120 --> 00:16:32.000
He's like, but if I were in the Haunt and

312
00:16:32.039 --> 00:16:34.200
you're just popping out, He's like, that seems awful, Like

313
00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:37.000
that's that's it's I can't He's like, I literally cannot

314
00:16:37.039 --> 00:16:41.919
imagine who would do that. And I was like, well,

315
00:16:42.120 --> 00:16:43.960
you got to have somebody in your class. It's like

316
00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:46.399
the weird kid who's like Adhd who just you know,

317
00:16:47.480 --> 00:16:49.559
can't keep I mean, he could do it fine. He's like,

318
00:16:49.639 --> 00:16:51.919
I guess, but he's like, even then, I don't know,

319
00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:54.080
so I think that's exactly it. You know. They're just

320
00:16:54.120 --> 00:16:56.799
like I want to go and have fun and hang

321
00:16:56.799 --> 00:16:59.840
out with people. I don't want to be alone and

322
00:17:00.120 --> 00:17:02.399
pop out of corners. And even though it's like sixteen

323
00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:04.680
year old could articulate it, yeah, and and to sound

324
00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:06.599
like and to sound like the old guy once again,

325
00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:10.039
because because I mean we used to when you're doing

326
00:17:10.119 --> 00:17:12.759
when you're doing multiple years with the same haunt, you know,

327
00:17:13.480 --> 00:17:16.400
fifteen years with Hella Scream, we would have families that

328
00:17:16.440 --> 00:17:19.119
the kids would be would grow up going, God, I

329
00:17:19.119 --> 00:17:21.400
can't wait till I'm eighteen so that I can actually

330
00:17:21.480 --> 00:17:23.960
get the job and come and do this this thing.

331
00:17:24.119 --> 00:17:27.359
Ye you know, we we we had at one point

332
00:17:27.400 --> 00:17:34.079
in time, there were we had three generations yep, of

333
00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:38.160
hot actors, you know, but that but that doesn't exist anymore.

334
00:17:38.640 --> 00:17:40.440
It also ties into and this is where I'm going

335
00:17:40.480 --> 00:17:42.839
to sound old, It also ties into the fact that

336
00:17:44.079 --> 00:17:47.200
what people want to do and what they are capable

337
00:17:47.240 --> 00:17:49.039
of doing are not the same thing.

338
00:17:49.559 --> 00:17:50.119
That's true.

339
00:17:50.559 --> 00:17:50.759
You know.

340
00:17:50.799 --> 00:17:52.559
They think, yeah, I could create a character and I

341
00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:54.920
could walk around and blah blah blah blah blah blah blah,

342
00:17:55.240 --> 00:18:00.440
and uh, you can't. They can't. And we It's interesting

343
00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:04.559
because we had this happen I've been doing because again,

344
00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:07.519
we can't fill everything with the regular auditions. I've been

345
00:18:07.519 --> 00:18:09.759
trying to fill them in with virtual auditions, and we

346
00:18:09.799 --> 00:18:12.880
had I've had two separate cases where in the virtual auditions,

347
00:18:13.240 --> 00:18:17.079
one person saw what I asked the person before them

348
00:18:17.079 --> 00:18:20.599
to do in a Zoom meeting, and they said, I

349
00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:22.319
just don't think this is my thing. I don't think

350
00:18:22.359 --> 00:18:25.119
I'm clever enough or creative enough to create these kinds

351
00:18:25.119 --> 00:18:28.079
of characters and to interact this way. So I'm just

352
00:18:28.119 --> 00:18:32.119
going to go now. And I was like, Okay, well,

353
00:18:32.200 --> 00:18:35.359
thank you. Would you feel more comfortable if I had

354
00:18:35.400 --> 00:18:38.720
to do something nonverbal? And she said, yeah, I'll try it.

355
00:18:38.839 --> 00:18:41.759
So she tried it, and then she said, but clearly

356
00:18:41.759 --> 00:18:44.079
it's just not me. And then we had another person

357
00:18:44.279 --> 00:18:49.000
who when they saw they didn't even see somebody else

358
00:18:49.039 --> 00:18:52.200
do it. When I asked them to improvise something and

359
00:18:52.240 --> 00:18:57.519
it was simple, he said, hmm, let me think about that, hmm,

360
00:18:59.039 --> 00:19:02.640
and he exited the meeting and completely ghoes to this Wow,

361
00:19:02.839 --> 00:19:04.440
no words, nothing, just ran away.

362
00:19:05.200 --> 00:19:07.839
I wonder, is this really?

363
00:19:07.880 --> 00:19:09.960
Like God, if I sound really old, but like, do

364
00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:12.519
you think that this is I know, Scott, You're like fine,

365
00:19:12.680 --> 00:19:13.200
but I mean, like.

366
00:19:13.160 --> 00:19:14.680
That's what I'm saying. That's why I say I should

367
00:19:14.759 --> 00:19:17.119
like that that crank yield stay off my yard, you know.

368
00:19:17.359 --> 00:19:19.720
But I mean, do you think that this has to

369
00:19:19.799 --> 00:19:25.319
do with the pandemic? Because remember kids, right, if we're

370
00:19:25.400 --> 00:19:30.200
if the people were in auditioning, now are pandemic kids,

371
00:19:30.240 --> 00:19:32.920
which means they missed like up to four years of

372
00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:35.400
social developer and development.

373
00:19:35.599 --> 00:19:37.119
Yeah, and I've.

374
00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:39.720
Noticed it, like I've noticed that like younger people are

375
00:19:39.920 --> 00:19:43.880
petrified of conversations with other people, like it cannot handle them,

376
00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:45.720
and like so do you think this is an after

377
00:19:45.839 --> 00:19:49.119
effect of that, Like, we have a four year group

378
00:19:49.240 --> 00:19:52.559
of kids that are exactly our hiring range that are

379
00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:55.960
terrified interact with people, so they don't want to.

380
00:19:55.920 --> 00:19:58.440
Act well, and they don't. I don't even think they

381
00:19:58.640 --> 00:20:00.759
I'll go even one step further. I don't even think

382
00:20:00.759 --> 00:20:04.839
they recognize live performance as acting. I don't. I don't

383
00:20:04.839 --> 00:20:08.880
think or even performing. I think they recognize content creation

384
00:20:09.119 --> 00:20:11.920
as performing. And that's easy because you can if you

385
00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:13.680
screw it up, you can always go back and fix it.

386
00:20:14.079 --> 00:20:15.720
You know, if it's a mess, you can always go

387
00:20:15.759 --> 00:20:17.480
back and go, oh, let me get let me retake that,

388
00:20:17.559 --> 00:20:23.319
let me do that again. But you know it's it's yeah,

389
00:20:23.480 --> 00:20:26.680
it's quite possible. It's quite possible that that is. So

390
00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:28.680
that just means that the pendulum is going to swing back,

391
00:20:29.039 --> 00:20:31.160
you know. It's it's kind it's kind of like each

392
00:20:31.200 --> 00:20:33.119
year with the flu or covid, we have to kind

393
00:20:33.119 --> 00:20:34.880
of take the temperature and see what the strain is

394
00:20:34.920 --> 00:20:37.200
for this year when it comes to casting and and

395
00:20:37.240 --> 00:20:38.839
what is it that they want. So that means that

396
00:20:38.880 --> 00:20:42.119
we're going to have to be significantly h not not me,

397
00:20:42.359 --> 00:20:45.359
because I'm working as an outside contractor. But my clients

398
00:20:45.400 --> 00:20:47.640
are going to have to be significantly more nimble in

399
00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:50.519
how they put their budgets together and how what they

400
00:20:50.519 --> 00:20:54.759
are offering, because you know, the tons of money may

401
00:20:54.799 --> 00:20:57.119
work one year, but the next year it has to

402
00:20:57.119 --> 00:20:58.759
be we're only going to hire in groups of five,

403
00:20:59.160 --> 00:21:02.359
you know, your friends. And we've tried that, you know,

404
00:21:02.440 --> 00:21:07.720
we've tried that for years. But it's a it's a

405
00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:11.319
pistol and and it's people just just running away. I mean,

406
00:21:11.359 --> 00:21:14.480
you know what you mentioned the COVID thing. One of

407
00:21:14.480 --> 00:21:17.680
the things that I do outside of the industry is

408
00:21:17.680 --> 00:21:21.559
I judge I judge thespian conferences just to see what

409
00:21:21.599 --> 00:21:23.799
the high school talent is that's up and coming. And

410
00:21:24.920 --> 00:21:27.319
the first year that they were able to come back

411
00:21:27.359 --> 00:21:31.599
and do it live after COVID I had there. It

412
00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:33.920
was a duet scene. One of the kids went up

413
00:21:33.960 --> 00:21:37.599
on one of their lines and just stopped, stood up

414
00:21:37.599 --> 00:21:40.519
and ran out of the room, leaving their their scene

415
00:21:40.519 --> 00:21:46.240
partners sitting there, and their scene partner just closed out

416
00:21:46.279 --> 00:21:48.279
the scene, got their stuff and got out as quickly

417
00:21:48.279 --> 00:21:48.920
as possible.

418
00:21:49.119 --> 00:21:49.480
Wow.

419
00:21:50.599 --> 00:21:54.440
So it's you may be exactly right, it's we've lost

420
00:21:54.440 --> 00:21:56.599
four years of socialization, So we're going to have to

421
00:21:56.680 --> 00:22:00.400
kind of build that back. And I don't know, you know,

422
00:22:00.480 --> 00:22:02.839
I'm I'm certainly open, especially to anybody listening, if you've

423
00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:05.319
got any ideas as to how do we make how

424
00:22:05.319 --> 00:22:08.640
do we make live performance in immersive theater or atmospheric

425
00:22:08.680 --> 00:22:10.640
theater or theme park performance or whatever you want to

426
00:22:10.680 --> 00:22:13.759
call it, How do we make that cool again so

427
00:22:13.799 --> 00:22:16.319
that you can get the people and keep the people.

428
00:22:16.359 --> 00:22:18.599
What is the what is the benefit? Because I mean,

429
00:22:18.680 --> 00:22:20.799
you know everyone can say, well, well, you know, pay

430
00:22:20.839 --> 00:22:23.039
them five hundred dollars an hour. Well, okay, we can

431
00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:25.839
hire one actor. I mean, you know, you think, you

432
00:22:25.839 --> 00:22:27.519
think the number of actors that in the in the

433
00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:30.759
haunt goes down. But I'm also from a designer standpoint,

434
00:22:30.759 --> 00:22:34.200
I would say I would rather have five really good

435
00:22:34.240 --> 00:22:40.480
performers I could design to that versus relying on you know,

436
00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:43.079
fifteen to twenty or you know, back in the back

437
00:22:43.079 --> 00:22:45.480
in the day. So back in the day, each house

438
00:22:46.079 --> 00:22:50.279
at Bush Gardens would have usually around thirty scare positions.

439
00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:53.079
And so when you say that you did a haunt

440
00:22:53.119 --> 00:22:57.000
that had five actors, yeah, yeah, that makes me, that

441
00:22:57.079 --> 00:22:58.119
makes my stomach turn.

442
00:22:58.799 --> 00:23:00.759
Yeah, and you know what, But I think they're right.

443
00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:02.480
I think if you look at my video, there's probably

444
00:23:02.480 --> 00:23:04.839
only five. Like in the comments, I was like, you know,

445
00:23:04.920 --> 00:23:07.319
I edited out portions because we didn't post the whole thing.

446
00:23:07.559 --> 00:23:09.680
But they're right, there was five. Because here's the thing.

447
00:23:09.759 --> 00:23:11.319
You know what I edited out. I edited out all

448
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:12.400
the parts without the actors.

449
00:23:12.680 --> 00:23:15.440
Yeah, yeah, the parts without the actors and in turn

450
00:23:15.480 --> 00:23:17.559
without the scares. So what you ended up doing is

451
00:23:17.599 --> 00:23:22.960
you edited out the long halways, yes, you know, and

452
00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:26.480
and in some cases they may be beautiful excuse me,

453
00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:28.480
they may be beautiful hallways, but they're not that interesting

454
00:23:28.519 --> 00:23:31.160
to watch. And in worst case scenario, you know, you

455
00:23:31.319 --> 00:23:33.519
edited out the black VisQueen and the two by fours.

456
00:23:33.799 --> 00:23:35.960
So so yeah, it's like two and a half minutes

457
00:23:35.960 --> 00:23:40.519
basically per Hant. Yeah, yeah, that is that's really interesting.

458
00:23:40.519 --> 00:23:43.599
I wonder because I think this is this is really

459
00:23:43.640 --> 00:23:46.000
like it is a problem. It's a problem everywhere, and

460
00:23:46.119 --> 00:23:50.359
I'm wondering, like that could be it, Like it may

461
00:23:50.359 --> 00:23:52.359
not be cool anymore, Like I think that might be it.

462
00:23:52.359 --> 00:23:55.559
It may not be cool anymore at all live entertainment

463
00:23:55.599 --> 00:23:59.240
as a whole, because especially in the Haunt space, I

464
00:23:59.279 --> 00:24:01.359
mean what's cool right now is like the people in

465
00:24:01.400 --> 00:24:04.039
the scare zones and like the scare acters and or

466
00:24:04.079 --> 00:24:07.720
the sliders and all that, but they don't do anything,

467
00:24:07.799 --> 00:24:09.720
Like I don't say anything. They just slide at you.

468
00:24:10.119 --> 00:24:16.960
And then the content creators also really don't like say anything, right,

469
00:24:17.079 --> 00:24:20.680
Like a lot of content creators. Maybe they do voiceovers,

470
00:24:20.680 --> 00:24:23.039
but like a lot of them, like they're doing a

471
00:24:23.079 --> 00:24:26.319
trend or doing a dance, or they're like or they're

472
00:24:26.359 --> 00:24:29.640
just doing like thirst traps or whatever, and they're not like,

473
00:24:29.680 --> 00:24:33.519
none of that involves actually talking to rite.

474
00:24:33.440 --> 00:24:36.160
Or communicating in any way, shape or form. Yeah, and

475
00:24:36.200 --> 00:24:39.279
again I can't. I can't sit here and say, yeah,

476
00:24:39.279 --> 00:24:42.039
that's stupid because these these kids are making more money

477
00:24:42.039 --> 00:24:46.440
than I am annually, and and you know, because my

478
00:24:46.799 --> 00:24:50.039
only fans ain't doing much. I'm just saying so no,

479
00:24:50.119 --> 00:24:53.319
I don't have an only fans. I really don't. But

480
00:24:53.319 --> 00:24:56.920
but yeah, it's and you know, maybe maybe that's the answer.

481
00:24:56.960 --> 00:24:59.720
Maybe it's uh, maybe it's the come and work for

482
00:24:59.839 --> 00:25:03.880
us and become an entrenched content creator. You know, maybe

483
00:25:03.920 --> 00:25:07.039
you offer fifteen positions that if you fill the entire

484
00:25:07.400 --> 00:25:09.079
if you if you sign a contract to fill the

485
00:25:09.240 --> 00:25:15.200
entire year. You can you can do content creation throughout,

486
00:25:15.240 --> 00:25:19.079
which was the exact opposite of the way haunts used

487
00:25:19.119 --> 00:25:21.680
to be because they wanted to control media. But the

488
00:25:21.720 --> 00:25:24.759
control over media is has gone out the window these days.

489
00:25:24.799 --> 00:25:27.160
So maybe maybe that is a possibility. I don't know.

490
00:25:27.880 --> 00:25:30.759
Yeah, I think that could be. That could be a

491
00:25:30.799 --> 00:25:33.079
real So it's interesting what I was going to say

492
00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:35.079
last thing, because I've already I've already like twenty five

493
00:25:35.079 --> 00:25:38.359
minutes ago we talked. I was gonna say, is they,

494
00:25:41.759 --> 00:25:44.200
by all accounts, six Flags this year is of is

495
00:25:44.240 --> 00:25:47.920
a hot mess. It's it's a shit show, like at

496
00:25:48.000 --> 00:25:52.359
every location. Magic Mountain didn't even open some of their

497
00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:55.279
haunts at all. You know, was it because of staffing

498
00:25:55.319 --> 00:25:57.319
or just because they were Here's the thing, we don't

499
00:25:57.359 --> 00:26:01.079
know why. My guess more so now is that it

500
00:26:01.160 --> 00:26:04.480
is staffing. I heard from some of the people on

501
00:26:04.519 --> 00:26:06.519
the Six Flags one that it that the Trigger Tree

502
00:26:06.519 --> 00:26:09.279
didn't open because it wasn't done. And I know, like

503
00:26:09.359 --> 00:26:11.319
again off the record, even when I was at Hershey

504
00:26:11.519 --> 00:26:14.920
and I was touring during the two hours before it

505
00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:17.279
was supposed to open, they were still drilling stuff.

506
00:26:17.200 --> 00:26:18.400
Right into the world.

507
00:26:18.480 --> 00:26:20.799
I think that comes down to staffing too, though. They

508
00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:23.000
just can't get the hands they need to put stuff up.

509
00:26:23.160 --> 00:26:25.640
And I will say some of the challenges that with

510
00:26:25.720 --> 00:26:29.039
a couple of the projects that I'm working on, it's yes,

511
00:26:29.119 --> 00:26:31.480
it's hands and skilled hands who can put it together.

512
00:26:31.680 --> 00:26:37.079
But it's also because again this there's a ripple effect,

513
00:26:37.759 --> 00:26:40.960
it's it's also supply chain. Now there's things that just

514
00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:44.240
aren't showing up. So you know, with with Haunts not

515
00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:47.000
opening on time, it could be because they don't have

516
00:26:47.039 --> 00:26:49.240
the internal staff, or it might just simply be because

517
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:51.759
the vacuuform panels that are supposed to come in aren't

518
00:26:51.799 --> 00:26:52.119
there yet.

519
00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:53.039
Oh I've heard that too.

520
00:26:53.160 --> 00:26:55.640
Yeahah, me too. I'm experiencing it firsthand.

521
00:26:55.839 --> 00:26:57.519
Yeah, yeah, I think.

522
00:26:58.039 --> 00:27:00.400
But what I was gonna say, I think six Flags

523
00:27:00.440 --> 00:27:04.279
is strategy and also to an extent, Hershey's right where

524
00:27:04.400 --> 00:27:08.319
it seems like the strategy of these places is moving

525
00:27:08.359 --> 00:27:11.640
almost the opposite of Universal. So I talked about how

526
00:27:11.640 --> 00:27:15.319
this year Universal is like there's basically no scare zones.

527
00:27:15.400 --> 00:27:19.240
It's just like, right, you know, they're so patchy. It

528
00:27:19.319 --> 00:27:21.440
seems like basically six Flags is like you know what,

529
00:27:22.119 --> 00:27:24.599
We're just a giant party, Like that's what we are.

530
00:27:24.640 --> 00:27:25.559
We're a giant party.

531
00:27:25.880 --> 00:27:28.799
We got quote unquote scare zones, but you know what,

532
00:27:28.839 --> 00:27:32.640
they're really just sliders and DJs and dancing and raving.

533
00:27:32.680 --> 00:27:35.119
It's just like a giant spooky rave with some like

534
00:27:35.559 --> 00:27:38.680
roaming characters and like hershey is great.

535
00:27:38.720 --> 00:27:39.480
I love the hurshey about.

536
00:27:39.440 --> 00:27:41.400
I'm not talking smack at all, but like you know,

537
00:27:41.480 --> 00:27:43.640
they do have a whole slider showcase. It's a whole

538
00:27:43.759 --> 00:27:46.519
It's a whole part of their entertainment schedule now is

539
00:27:46.519 --> 00:27:49.880
that stuff and the scare zones are a big piece

540
00:27:49.920 --> 00:27:52.279
of it. And I'm like it's because they show up,

541
00:27:52.920 --> 00:27:54.799
right and like then you're like, well we'll design a

542
00:27:54.799 --> 00:27:56.240
show around them because we know they're going to be

543
00:27:56.279 --> 00:27:59.839
there basically. And so you know, if you only have

544
00:28:00.039 --> 00:28:02.640
I have actors in a house, but you have you know,

545
00:28:02.680 --> 00:28:04.759
a few dozen sliders or I mean like it's like,

546
00:28:05.160 --> 00:28:07.960
you know, and I'm not sure there's anything wrong with that.

547
00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:11.559
I mean like it might be a good strategy to

548
00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:15.240
make it more of a party at some of these places,

549
00:28:15.720 --> 00:28:19.160
to differentiate yourself. I mean, like I don't know, because

550
00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:23.279
to me, I feel like maybe again, this is almost

551
00:28:23.319 --> 00:28:27.119
better for the ecosystem, because like, if six Flags can

552
00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:31.559
make just a basically a rave, I'm not sure there's

553
00:28:31.559 --> 00:28:35.440
anything wrong with that because they have the infrastructure to

554
00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:38.480
make the party more than so, like you know what

555
00:28:39.039 --> 00:28:41.759
independent haunts have. They have the Haunt that they've been

556
00:28:41.759 --> 00:28:43.559
working on for thirty years, and they have millions and

557
00:28:43.599 --> 00:28:47.440
millions and millions of dollars in that. Six Flags doesn't

558
00:28:47.440 --> 00:28:51.480
have the staffing and the supply chain to make haunts,

559
00:28:51.680 --> 00:28:54.519
but they have the infrastructure to host a party. So

560
00:28:54.759 --> 00:28:59.039
just host a rave with spooky characters and then let

561
00:28:59.079 --> 00:29:02.440
the attractions, you know, the independent haunts have their houses.

562
00:29:02.599 --> 00:29:04.880
I think that is fine, or I think that could

563
00:29:04.880 --> 00:29:05.680
be where we're going.

564
00:29:06.880 --> 00:29:11.240
Unfortunately, I think you may be right. But you know,

565
00:29:11.359 --> 00:29:17.079
people are still people are still flocking to Halloween hornites

566
00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:21.559
and they are still you know, whether it's good, bad,

567
00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:26.200
or and different, they're still going. So you know, it's

568
00:29:28.160 --> 00:29:30.799
the challenge there, though is and where the what's going

569
00:29:30.880 --> 00:29:33.519
to be the pendulum that swings back is when it

570
00:29:33.559 --> 00:29:36.720
gets to a party and they lean in too much

571
00:29:36.759 --> 00:29:40.240
to the party. This is the challenge I've found in

572
00:29:40.319 --> 00:29:43.559
almost all attractions. Once they see success, they start to

573
00:29:43.640 --> 00:29:47.119
chase success. So once they see that something works, it's like, oh,

574
00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:48.759
well the party thing works, well, let's just do Let's

575
00:29:48.799 --> 00:29:49.920
just make it all a party. Let's get rid of

576
00:29:49.960 --> 00:29:52.240
the houses completely, let's just make a party. And then

577
00:29:52.279 --> 00:29:55.920
it so loses interest because it's like, okay, well, part

578
00:29:55.960 --> 00:29:57.559
of the reason the party worked is because it was

579
00:29:57.599 --> 00:30:00.359
different from the haunts. And when you take the hont out,

580
00:30:00.400 --> 00:30:02.559
then the party is the same as the other party,

581
00:30:02.599 --> 00:30:05.039
which is the same as the other party. Uh.

582
00:30:05.680 --> 00:30:06.759
Interesting you say that.

583
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:11.240
So you know Insomniac Events that does the uh that

584
00:30:11.319 --> 00:30:15.400
does basically d M, you know, big big DM.

585
00:30:15.400 --> 00:30:16.160
That's what they're no rank.

586
00:30:16.559 --> 00:30:18.839
So they have a Halloween event and I know this

587
00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:22.160
year they are hiring some pretty well known haunters to

588
00:30:22.200 --> 00:30:24.000
build a haunted house at their DM event.

589
00:30:26.079 --> 00:30:29.079
So again, well there is no there is no magic bullet.

590
00:30:29.119 --> 00:30:31.599
It ain't gonna work. You know, we have no solutions here. Sorry,

591
00:30:31.599 --> 00:30:33.599
I wish, I wish we did, but we did ask

592
00:30:33.640 --> 00:30:36.720
some really cool questions, so we weren't quite as unhinged

593
00:30:36.720 --> 00:30:40.039
as normal. But we're not too bad a shape anyway.

594
00:30:40.279 --> 00:30:43.799
That's enough for now, guys, Thank you again for being

595
00:30:43.960 --> 00:30:46.759
uh being part of the unhinged group or I'm sorry.

596
00:30:46.880 --> 00:30:52.319
The pro group, the pro group, the pro a ka unhinged,

597
00:30:53.880 --> 00:30:55.960
and uh you know, we'll see it. We'll see at

598
00:30:56.000 --> 00:30:56.440
the next show.

599
00:30:57.160 --> 00:30:58.200
Yeah,