Allen Hopps on Valentine Haunts, Interactivity, and Trends

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Dark Hour Haunted House is bringing back Love is Blind

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for Valentine's Weekend, but this time with a new interactive

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mechanic that turns traditional black light haunt into a choice

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driven experience.

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Welcome to the show.

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I'm Philip on the Hunt Attraction Network show. We bring

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you the news and stories you need to prepare for Halloween.

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This podcast is just one part of what we do.

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You can find videos, articles, and our free weekly newsletter

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linked in the show notes. Dark Hour Haunted House in Plano,

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Texas will run Love is Blind on Friday, February thirteenth

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and Saturday, February fourteenth. Dark Hour previously offered Love is

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Blind as a traditional blackout haunt, but the reception was mixed,

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so building on their previous successes with the Dead By

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Dark Hour series, the team set out to resurrect Love Blind,

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drawing what they have learned from those.

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More interactive events.

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The core mechanic for this year's Love is Blind centers

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around a glowstick that both helps and hurts. Guests need

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the light to see where they're going, but monsters are

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drawn to it, so if the light is visible, actors

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respond If guests hide the light by covering the glow stick.

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The monsters have passed them by, but then they can't see.

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Today I'm joined by Alan Hopps, and we're learning all

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about Love is Blind and why he wants guests to

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interact with the world as part of the design, not

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just react to the scares. Here's Alan, Alan Hopps, the man,

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the myth, the legend that.

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Is that's excessive. I've just been around a while as all.

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We're speaking because you have a Valentine's event coming up,

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tell me about what you are planning.

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Okay, many years ago we had our Valentine's Day event,

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Love is Blind, and that event was way before we

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did Gamify Dead by Dark Hour. It was just a

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lights out, haunted house with a glow stick, and it

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was mildly successful, but we actually got more complaints because

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we're known for our set work and set design and costumes,

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and for any show that's known for that, a blackout

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show is anti climactic or unreboarding. A lot of enough

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customers made note. We change it into a zombie show

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that we called Fever, which was good. We did that

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for a while until we stopped doing that. In the Pandemic,

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we just stopped opening as much after the pandemic. So

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in wanting to do a Valentine because this is a

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the Golden Valentine's here Friday thirteenth, Saturday fourteenth, every haunt

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should be open. So because of that, I wanted to

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do something a little special, and I thought that bringing

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back Love is Blind would be a good way to

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do that, and combining it with some of our Dead

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by Dark Hour mechanics that we've done in the past,

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and we tested a mechanic that worked really well in

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our December show sleigh Belts. So that mechanic is that

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they get the glow stick and as they're going through,

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the monsters are of course drawn to the glow stick.

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If they make an effort to hide the glow stick

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and not let the light come out, the monsters will

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pass them by because they didn't see them. So that

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means if there's a monster in hiding, they're going to

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start making noise as they come to you, and then

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they can kind of you can hide that light, but

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then they might see someone else and go after them.

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And I think the whole concept of this is that

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hopefully people are coming in couples. I know we'll have

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a large amount of couples, and I think we'll get

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some of those situations where in order to distract the

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monster from your so you know, you will let your

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light shine a little bit and then the monster gets

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drawn off of them to you. That's the dynamic that

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I really want the actors to play with. We've had

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some really cool stuff where in the past we did

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the Banshees for our Saint Patrick's show. We had a

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mechanic there where if you weren't moving, they wouldn't see you.

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They can only see you if you're moving, and that

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really added some intensity and some you know, just a

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fun dynamic in the show. And I think this whole

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hide the light, which you really need to guide yourself,

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you know, but if you then if you release that

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light and you know you can see well enough to move,

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then the monsters are really going after you. Every blackout

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show is kind of oh, the glowstick just draws the

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monster to you. Yes, let's use that and let's you know,

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then give them a way to hide that light, cover

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it up and they're in the dark for a bit,

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but then the monster can't get them.

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I really like the idea of adding an element that

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allows you to play on the concept of a date

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night specifically too, where it's this is meant to be

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not just an interplay between the actors, but it's meant

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to also be an interplay between the people going together

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in groups.

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Yeah, yeah, again, this is a dead by Dark Hour

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show in that the we've made creatures called the Red Ones,

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and they have led the eyes so you can see

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them coming around corners because their eyes are like headlights,

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so you can tell when they're in the area, when

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they're coming, and if they're about to sticker. You know,

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someone in the back of the group, but the light

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shows up in the front, you know they It's a chance,

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a chance, it's a chance to play. And what I

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love about the Dead by Dark Hour format in general

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is that it gets people who are really used to

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haunted houses and maybe they're a little jaded, it gets

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them back into it. I think that there's a need

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to have the audience interact with the world in more

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than just a I get scared or I don't wait,

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that's right.

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Yeah.

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If you sit there and you watch a chainsaw exit

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at a haunted attraction, get you watch some people are

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scared and they run. But what is really revealing is

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the ones that just don't yehause there's no negative consequence

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to not running from the chainsaw help me. Yeah, yeah,

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like I'm gonna, I'm gonna walk out of here at

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a reasonable pace because I respect what you're trying to do.

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I'm not gonna make you feel bad, but I'm I'm

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I'm too fat to run. Also, let's you don't do that.

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In the past, most of the off season events have

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just been blackout. I mean that's like the industry standard.

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It's just turn the lights off and oh it's a

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new haunt.

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Now, Yeah, there's less input and you know, what are

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you changing as far as input goes? Yeah, and in

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this case, it's a it's kind of a game mechanic.

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I think that's something that haunts are going to play

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with these different techniques. And the Dead by Dark Hour

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show is its concept is that the killers can kill you,

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and they kill you by putting a sticker on you,

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and each killer has their own, so you end up

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with people who don't want to get killed and they dodge,

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and then you get people who they want to be

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killed by everybody because they want all the stickers and

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even sell a poster in the gift shop that they

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can stick their stickers to as a memento. Yep, yep.

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It's finding new ways to do this mechanic, like with

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the lights, like with the monsters not seeing you if

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you're not moving. Has been a lot of fun. It's

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a lot of fun for the actors. It's a lot

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of fun for the audience. And you know, I've learned

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that they can only remember two rules at a time,

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two at a time. They can remember two at a

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time and make whatever those things are look very different.

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That's about it. And you have to do a video

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to introduce them to it. In the front. We play

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that in our lobby, and we played in the first

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room just in case it didn't catch. One of the

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lobby plays through. And it's a pretty good way of

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conveying the information. My audience is now rather informed on it.

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If we do these enough, I have that I have

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a core group of about four or five hundred who

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are going to come to every show, every off season show,

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and now they know exactly what to do.

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Yeah, I was that's gonna be. My next question actually

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is like how are you operationally handling it? And it

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sounds like if you have a good amount of repeat people.

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They know that there's something they can do to interact,

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and then they're just waiting for you to explain what

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this version of the rule of mechanic is.

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For our holiday show, I was out by the queue

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and I'm talking with somebody and there was like five

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or six young ladies and all at the same time.

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They were like two groups from going in. They all

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pulled the hair tie off their wrists and they put

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their hair back in a ponytail, and I'm like, are

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you ready for adventure? They're like, now the stickers won't

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get caught in their hair. So they knew, you know

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what I mean. So they had been here before and

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they knew the mechanic and they were kind of prepared,

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which is you can't ask for more than that. As

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far as that's an interactive audience who has made decisions

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ahead of time based off of the dynamics of your event. Ye,

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that means you're in their head and you're affecting their

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everyday life. That's awesome. It was just really cool to

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see of how invested the people were, and you know,

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the more of that I think that you can do,

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the better.

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It's just fascinating to hear the evolution of this too.

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I think there's a lot of listening involved, like you're

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watching as well, but you're also paying attention to cues

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from the audience to really understand what they're resonating with,

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and I.

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Want to understand what involves them. I think one of

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the hardest things we have to do is kind of

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make people give a damn about what we're doing and

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make them care about why we're doing this. And it's

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not my story. It's not you know that you should

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just support haunted houses all the time. It's that I'm

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going to find a way to wake up your soul

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and yes, make you feel hunted a little bit, make

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you feel a little more awake and alive. And that's

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so huge to what we do in actor training all

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the time. I say, an antelope never feels more alive

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when it just escaped a lion. That's when it feels like, yes,

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life is good, I'm alive. And you want them to

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have that feeling in your haunted attraction. They escaped, they

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got away, they did it. And what mechanic can I

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add to play with that. In the Dead by Daylight

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video game, they have where a character can get taken

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out of your group and they get hooked. They get

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hung on a hook somewhere and you have to go

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find them. And that's a mechanic that we're working on.

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It's actually a lanyard, so you can stand them on

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a one foot box and then you put a lanyard

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on their neck and it looks like the hook is

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coming out of their chest because you put that lanyard

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on them, and if their friends want to get them down,

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they have to take the lanyard off and hang it

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on the hook beside it so that the killer can

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go get the next person. But then you have to

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move them forward into your show so that the group

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comes to get them. And so that's a mechanic we're

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going to try and work in and it might be

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for Valentine's we'll see.

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So that's Love is Blind and some of your future

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plans zooming now a little bit. We're coming up on

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transworld now, and of course this is when haunts are

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thinking about their seasons and on this year. In your opinion,

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what are the big things haunted houses need to be

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thinking about? Is they going into twenty twenty six?

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Boy? Right now, the world sucks. I'll be honest with you,

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it's how divisive is the world at large. There are

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two camps of people, and there's probably multi mini camps

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within those two camps, and we have to think about

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I have a this is a hard word to use

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because it has a connotation now, but we have to

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kind of make a safe space where everybody can come

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and have the brand of fun that we're giving. And

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I think it's important to not have a message. I

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think it's important to not your brain doesn't have to

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do anything but come to my haunted house, get chaste

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and survive, you know. And that's the message. It's haunted

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houses are easier and better than the real world because

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I label the bad guys. All the bad guys are

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in a mask. All the people who are going to

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come after you, I'm paying them to come after you,

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you know, And you chose to be here. What a

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lovely labeled world it is inside of a haunted house.

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And I think getting that message out to people that

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they can kind of take a brain break while they're here.

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But I also think there's things in twenty twenty six

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that I'm going to do to extend the night. We're

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creating an audio file that I want them to listen

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to on the drive in that way, on the way in,

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I want here. It's part of your night. It's part

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of the night too. Play this audio while you're driving in,

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whether it's headphones, whether it's in the car for the

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group of people. But ideally you're going to have a

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group of people in a car, encourage them to carpool

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and helps your parking lot. But you're making that little

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evil dead cast in their car as they go in.

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Is it a family, is it a group of friends

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and you are. They're playing the audio and that sets

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them up for the haunt, and then you give them

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that experience. We don't do anything interactive in that way

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in October at this point. The dead by Dark Hour

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format I find kind of breaks down a little bit

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at about two two hundred people in an evening. More

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than that and I would need to be open a

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little longer.

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But yeah, I really like both those ideas, especially the

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I think the safe space concept, just because you know,

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if haunts are escapism, then they need to actually function

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as escapism, they can't be the other something like that.

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But I also like the idea of the value like

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extending the night, what that does also in principle, is

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it plays to that value minded consumer that I guess

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it depends on your haunt and where you're located. But

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you know, we are we're hearing about the VIP people

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that you know are going to pay five times as

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much because they want a frictionless experience. Then you have

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the more value minded customers who really are making tough

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choices about their entertainment, you know, and you're up against Netflix,

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so they can have a month of Netflix where they

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can go to your haunt. And what is the value

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that you're extending. I like the idea of you're adding

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on extra value for that that they get to part

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of the experience.

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I want to make two quick notes. You mentioned VIP.

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I realized that at no point did our VIP customers

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get our rules because this year I stepped into security

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and I was I'm like, why are so many of

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these security calls VIP people? Are they paying more so

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they feel entitled? Maybe That's where my brain immediately jumped,

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and then I'm like, wait, no one ever told them

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the rules because they come in, they go into a

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little room, and then they go into the show. We

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blast the rules. If you're in line, you're gonna hear

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the rules five or six times, and even if you

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00:14:42.360 --> 00:14:45.279
get into a shoot, there's a big rules sign in

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front of you and it's okay. So now the VIP

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concierge has to read them the rules so they know.

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But that got me thinking of there's so much of

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the experience that they're missing by doing VIP and Trevor

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Noah was doing an interview or talking with someone and

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he said he really felt like he had made it

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when he reached out and told one of the theme

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parks that he wanted to go with some of his

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friends to the theme park and they were like, okay,

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we're going to set you up with a VIP concierge

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and you're going to go from and he said there

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was They we went to a roller coaster, we did

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the roller coaster, they picked us up, they walked us

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to the next ride, and we did that ride and

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the next and he said it wasn't as good of

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an experience because he didn't get the anticipation of talking

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with his friends beforehand about what they think it might

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be and what's going to come up, and then at

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the end they didn't get that decompressing conversation in line

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for the next ride, and they didn't even spend as

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much time in the gift shops because it's and he's

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right there. That's part of the EXPERI sperience is the

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people that you come with and you're sharing this with them,

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and I think that's an amazing part of what we

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do and we shouldn't lose sight of that.

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I think where it breaks down, and this may not

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be a problem for all most haunted houses, so I

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might just be in crazy world with thinking about it

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in a different in a bigger space, But I think

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where that breaks down is Disneyland rides that are four hours, right,

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you don't need four hours of anticipation. So I think

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where it breaks down is where like maybe the better

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way to think of it is audit your VIP experience

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and ensure that you're not leaving an element of the

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experience out, like the rules, but also the crowd engagement.

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So like, they will need to wait two hours to

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get into your haunt if they're paying more, but maybe

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they still get to see the line and be in

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the room of the line, but it's not like as long,

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So I think there's probably a breaking point somewhere there

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where it's okay, this is too much.

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I want people to be in line between fifteen and

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thirty minutes.

332
00:17:00.519 --> 00:17:01.559
Yep, that's reasonable.

333
00:17:01.600 --> 00:17:05.119
I think that actually helps the haunted house experience because

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you do have that anticipation. You're watching groups go in

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and you know, and you're watching how they act as

336
00:17:10.680 --> 00:17:13.839
they go in, and then you know you have a

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chance to talk about that upcoming and enjoy the comfort.

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00:17:17.079 --> 00:17:18.960
I think the worst date that you could go on

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00:17:19.319 --> 00:17:22.359
like a normal date is going to the movies, because

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you get there, you go into the movie, and you're

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both supposed to sit there in the dark and not

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00:17:26.440 --> 00:17:30.119
talk to each other for two hours, and then the

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date's over and you go home like you learned nothing

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about that person. That's right, and in all honesty, there's

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not a lot of communication inside the haunt. You want

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them to have that twenty minutes or so to talk

347
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in the beginning and then go through the show and

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then have a gift shop, have a relaxing place where

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they can come out, catch their breath, maybe buy some

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merch and talk about the show that they just did.

351
00:17:57.880 --> 00:18:00.519
It's about the communal experience, right, It's about going through

352
00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:02.680
a thing together, but then you also need the reflection

353
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time on the thing. I will say, if the haunt

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has a midway, or if it's a bigger attraction, or

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if it's a theme park and they have multiple things,

356
00:18:09.640 --> 00:18:12.519
it's a little bit different because you have the time

357
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in between. Is there anything that I didn't bring up

358
00:18:15.759 --> 00:18:18.440
about the about Love is Blind or any of the

359
00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:22.240
things you're thinking about going into this year.

360
00:18:22.440 --> 00:18:24.440
As an industry, I think that we need to have

361
00:18:24.480 --> 00:18:28.200
a conversation about AI as an industry. I don't want

362
00:18:28.279 --> 00:18:31.880
us to use AI for logos. Ye, I don't want

363
00:18:31.920 --> 00:18:38.400
us to use AI for our art. If a horror

364
00:18:38.440 --> 00:18:43.799
movie has a video cover that is AI generated, I

365
00:18:43.839 --> 00:18:47.279
think the movie's bad. Yeah, you know, why wouldn't you

366
00:18:47.319 --> 00:18:49.200
think that about a haunted house? Show me a picture

367
00:18:49.200 --> 00:18:50.160
from your haunted house.

368
00:18:50.880 --> 00:18:53.279
I don't know. It's weird because if it becomes indistinguishable,

369
00:18:53.279 --> 00:18:55.480
then how will you know if it's AI? And then

370
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also it comes back to doesn't really matter if a

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human is accountable for it. I think that has to

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be the key, if a human is accountable for the output.

373
00:19:04.480 --> 00:19:06.720
And at that point, I'm not sure if you if

374
00:19:06.759 --> 00:19:07.359
it does matter?

375
00:19:07.559 --> 00:19:10.920
Just AI listens every meeting I have in my office.

376
00:19:11.079 --> 00:19:12.759
I turn this sucker on and then I get a

377
00:19:12.799 --> 00:19:17.440
transcript of it. And I want AI in my ticketing system.

378
00:19:17.799 --> 00:19:21.680
I want AI in my spreadsheets. I want AI to

379
00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:24.319
help me with math and taxes and all of that.

380
00:19:24.759 --> 00:19:27.519
I'm okay with AI adding art into a place that

381
00:19:27.519 --> 00:19:30.200
wouldn't have had art otherwise. There's a lot of things

382
00:19:30.200 --> 00:19:33.160
where they never would have hired an artist for an image.

383
00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:36.519
They might have stolen one, but they wouldn't hire an

384
00:19:36.559 --> 00:19:40.480
artist for it. But they will just hop in chat

385
00:19:40.519 --> 00:19:42.480
cheap at or whatever and make an image for this

386
00:19:42.720 --> 00:19:45.759
which would not have had an image before. I'm a

387
00:19:45.839 --> 00:19:50.079
Haunt consultant and I do things. I will hop into AI.

388
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:53.640
I'll describe a set of what I want this set

389
00:19:53.680 --> 00:19:56.319
to look like, and I'll say, and I wanted to

390
00:19:56.359 --> 00:19:58.599
feel like this movie, and I want it to feel

391
00:19:58.599 --> 00:20:02.160
like this movie or this scene or this chapter from

392
00:20:02.200 --> 00:20:05.759
this book, and I want to see this in that set.

393
00:20:05.880 --> 00:20:09.039
And here's my color palette. And I'll put all that

394
00:20:09.160 --> 00:20:13.480
in and it'll spit me out some images and a

395
00:20:13.480 --> 00:20:16.519
lot of the time it's pretty good. And then I'll

396
00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:19.240
build that. But I knew what I wanted to look like,

397
00:20:19.920 --> 00:20:23.680
but I can't describe it to my head of carpentry

398
00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:28.640
and end up with it looking that same way. And

399
00:20:29.359 --> 00:20:31.720
it's really nice to have an employee that you can

400
00:20:31.799 --> 00:20:34.839
bounce ideas off of and you won't hurt their feelings.

401
00:20:35.240 --> 00:20:38.519
I don't have to play the game of I got

402
00:20:38.519 --> 00:20:41.880
to protect their ego. I've got to understand their interest.

403
00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:43.799
I don't know. I don't have to do that. We

404
00:20:43.799 --> 00:20:46.200
can just honestly bounce ideas back and forth. And now

405
00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:48.640
it's kind of like talking to me because it's gotten

406
00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:51.599
enough of my input that that it knows the output

407
00:20:51.720 --> 00:20:54.960
that I want. Is it an echo chamber? Yes? Will

408
00:20:55.000 --> 00:20:58.960
I arrive at a decision and options faster using it

409
00:20:59.000 --> 00:21:00.279
than not? Yes?

410
00:21:00.920 --> 00:21:02.440
We got it. We gotta stop here now we do.

411
00:21:02.519 --> 00:21:04.920
That's what we're getting in. But okay, I'm gonna stop recording.

412
00:21:05.039 --> 00:21:06.599
Thank you so much, thank you, thank you.

413
00:21:07.599 --> 00:21:09.680
No problem, thank you. I appreciate you having me on.

414
00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:13.559
Today's episode was edited by me Philippernandez, with post production

415
00:21:13.640 --> 00:21:17.240
by David Swape and original music composed by Chris Thomas.

416
00:21:17.640 --> 00:21:20.759
Support for today's episode comes from Gantum Lightning and Controls.

417
00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:25.240
Gantum illuminates attractions worldwide with the world's smallest intelligent spotlights.

418
00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:28.200
From Dark Hour to nether World, Super Mario Land to

419
00:21:28.319 --> 00:21:32.400
Hagrid's Bike, Gantum goes where other fixtures can't see what

420
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you're missing With a free demo, sign up at gantum

421
00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:38.880
dot com slash demo. That's scantum dot com slash demo.

422
00:21:39.119 --> 00:21:43.160
The ha N team includes Daryl Plunky, Emily Luis Rua,

423
00:21:43.359 --> 00:21:48.279
Megan Spells, Gavin Burns and Omniadventures. Until next Time, Stay Scary.

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00:21:50.759 --> 00:21:55.039
This is a Haunted Attraction Network production